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TRUMP MICHAEL WOLFF JOINS JOANNA COLES ... The Daily Beast / Inside Trump's Head Truth About Trump’s Miserable Mar-a-Lago Christmas PLAY YOUTUBE VIDEO Original article: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3rbNNKeWMc
Truth About Trump’s Miserable Mar-a-Lago Christmas \| Inside Trump's Head The Daily Beast 515K subscribers ... 444,301 views ... 16K likes Premiered Dec 27, 2025 Inside Trump's Head Michael Wolff joins Joanna Coles to peel back what Christmas looks like inside Donald Trump’s carefully staged world at Mar-a-Lago — a holiday less about family and warmth than performance, attention, and control. From the bored, rope-off table at the center of the patio to Trump’s late-night torrent of Truth Social posts, Wolff maps how even Christmas becomes another arena for validation. They examine Melania’s rare flash of animation beside her father, the eerie surge of hyper-religious messaging from Trump-world, and the rituals that feel rehearsed rather than heartfelt. As the conversation widens, they trace how sagging TV ratings, Hollywood power plays, and proximity to Trump himself still dictate the action around him. 📖 Title: Truth About Trump’s Miserable Mar-a-Lago Christmas 👂 Podcast: Inside Trump's Head 📺 Episode: 53 🎧 Format: Full Podcast 📅 Date: December 27, 2025 🎙️ Hosts: Joanna Coles, Michael Wolff #news #trump #podcast Click here to become an official member of the Daily Beast's YouTube community: / @thedailybeast Visit our new Beauty website The Looker: https://thelooker.thedailybeast.com/ Have a question or comment for us? Send us an email: beastpod@thedailybeast.com Subscribe to Inside Trump's Head wherever you get your podcasts: https://pod.link/1767675909 Subscribe to The Last Laugh wherever you get your podcasts: https://pod.link/1456474041 Subscribe to The Daily Beast Podcast wherever you get your podcasts: https://pod.link/1508202790 The Daily Beast is committed to accurate, fair, independent, fast, and accountable journalism. We seek the truth and report it honestly, without fear or favor. We ground robust and provocative opinions in fact. Subscribe on YouTube: / @thedailybeast Follow us on Instagram: / thedailybeast Share this video on BlueSky: https://bsky.app/profile/thedailybeas... Share this video on X: / thedailybeast Share this video on Facebook: / thedailybeast Peter Burgess COMMENTARY Peter Burgess Transcript 0:00 Where are we on the Epstein files? Among the things that we certainly know is that Donald Trump's friendship with Jeffrey Epstein was much closer than than anything he has ever represented, and that I'm trying to be careful here. Donald Trump was involved in Jeffrey Epstein's lifestyle. Michael Wolff. Joanna Coles. Merry Christmas. Thank you. I was going to say Happy Boxing Day because we're recording this on the morning of the 26th. And Boxing Day is is your holiday? It's not our holiday. Well, what is Boxing Day? Boxing day is a British tradition because, in grand families like, you know, think Downton Abbey. Obviously the staff were working flat out all Christmas Day to provide a suitably opulent Christmas feast. 1:02 And so Boxing Day, after they cleared up and swept up from the family, Boxing Day was the day they got off and they could unbox or they could open their gift, which was extra money from the family they worked for. I once went to actually a Boxing Day dinner at a grand house in, in your country, and I've remembered it ever since. It was like. Like, this is what, Christmas. This was what Christmas should be. This is what families gathered around, welcoming other people into their midst. Should be. So, Go figure. Okay, well, usually boxing Day people go. There's a lot of hunting on those big families. You know, there's often a Boxing Day hunt. No, this was actually after After the hunt, which I did not go on. Okay. Was it a hunt with horses or was it a walking hunt? 2:02 I believe it was a walking hunt. Okay. Okay. Well, it's. I will say I didn't grow up doing that, but I have done it occasionally, and it's enormous fun. And then you get a flask of something called bull shot, which is basically bouillon with or broth with, vodka. Yeah. No, I yeah, I had, I had, made signals that I would have liked an invitation, but, to this hunt. But no one invited me. Well, I didn't know about this. Yes, because. People would be terrified at the idea of you having a shotgun. And, you. Know, I. Mean, this is a man who can't drive. You can barely walk 200 yards when you're. You're like, where am I, where am I? So, I think it's better not to give you a shotgun. That would be my, Anyway, it's Boxing Day, and, how do you think it is waking up on Christmas morning at Mar-A-Lago? We know the president was there because we saw him looking, frankly, quite bored at Christmas Eve dinner. 3:05 Thank you to all the people that posted their videos of Mar-A-Lago, which we watched with enormous interest. Well, then he apparently spent Christmas Eve night, posting on Truth Social. I think over 100 posts. So I assume that he sat up in bed and just went crazy. So we saw him having dinner on the Mar-A-Lago patio with Melania, first lady, lest anybody needs reminding, because she's not there very often. And his father in law, Victor. That cannot so naps who I find a fascinating character. He's only two years older than Donald Trump. He's like a smaller, squatter version of Donald Trump in terms of Melania marrying her father. But what a journey he's had. I mean, he grew up in communist Czechoslovakia, and was a car dealer. So I see lot is. Invested money and grow up in. Right. 4:07 But Melania had. Communist Eastern Europe. Right. But Melania has spent less of her time as an adult under communism. And here Victor naps is sitting opposite the president of the United States, who's miraculously married his daughter. And there he is at Mar-A-Lago. What an incredible journey. No. Well, you know, I mean, it's a whole subtext, of contemporary history. The, the women, the Eastern European women who became models, who went to the West and all. You know, I think that was part of the goal was to try to, try to marry someone and improve your station well, and improve their station. She definitely improved her station. But what was notable about the, videos that people were posting from the event, and I think this was a combination of members and people who were serving 5:06 at the event, was how animated our first lady looked with her father. When we are not used to seeing her looking remotely animated. And just to just to set the scene. So they are on the Mar-A-Lago terrace. I imagine it's about 75, five degrees. It's is filled with other members. We're in the high season now, actually. It's peak Palm Beach. Yes. And why these people are not having, their, their Christmas Eve with their families. We can we can only guess, but, Donald Trump is where he always is. At the table in the center with a, with a red rope around his table. You know why there is this red group around his table is. It's kind of confusing, because the table is right in the center of of of of everything. And, and everyone is, I think, 6:06 I think it is clear to everyone that this is Donald Trump, the red rope. Red rope is certainly not protecting him. I guess it's actually. Well, maybe it's like the brim of Melania's hat. It gives him a sort of perimeter around which you shouldn't lean in. Yeah, I don't know. And everybody, everybody in the on the terrace comes up to him. It's not as if. Stay away. Actually. Actually, it's it's come a little closer is what the rope means. Well, what was so fascinating about it was that he looks very bored to be sitting with his wife and father in law, and then every now and then. And it's unclear if this is true, because politicians do this all the time. And I know he's not a traditional politician, but where they pretend that they see someone in the crowd and they kind of wave and he does a lot of looking bored. 7:00 And then suddenly animated and doing his face, sort of holding his fist up and pointing at people, which I'm assuming, other Mar-A-Lago guests. No, it's a it's a yeah, it's a Trump thing to recognize people constantly looking, you know, even I remember in the, in the old days before he was done or before, before there was any possibility that he would be the president of the United States. I used to see him out in New York on occasion at night and because because we we were we were acquainted at some minor minor level when in, in Rooms of Strangers, he would see me, as I say, a minor acquaintance, and his face would light up. So so that always is that that strange thing about about who you know, about seeing someone you know about having the importance 8:00 of knowing someone, the idea that you're anonymous is anathema. That's a very interesting observation. It's a very American thing. I think. I remember there was a character who descended on London in the 90s called Michael for Mullin, who was the American editor of Q. Who I knew very well. Right. So very entertaining character, very lively, came to an untimely and unfortunate end, which I'll come to in a second. But one of the things that fascinated British people about him was at the time, there was a club, I guess, the media equivalent of Mar a Lago, perhaps in the center of Soho called the Groucho Club. And Michael would often have a booth or a table there for lunch, and he would walk round the entire restaurant saying hello to people at the tables and people fascinated by this, because it turned out he didn't know any of these people, but he would go around, say hi to people, introduce himself. Hello, I'm Michael Vermaelen, and it was just fascinating to British people who, like I say, who is that fellow that was just introduced himself? 9:06 Because that's so culturally weird to to a British person to do that. In fact, you want to be anonymous if you're British. So anyway, he came to an untimely end. Unfortunately, he also he became. He and. He became. Yes. And wait, he got to be very, very fat. I a matter of fact, I saw that the arc of his, of his weight gain, which was kind of extraordinary. Well, his. Weight gain was because he fell and hurt his ankle and wouldn't get it treated and couldn't walk, you know. And he but he became the editor of British GQ and actually basically on under his editorship that became an extraordinarily successful magazine, quite separate from the American GQ. True. And, I notice he would notice that we're both wearing Boxing Day casual today. You didn't have one of your cardigans on, but I do have a cardigan. 10:06 I don't have a blazer. In honor of the fact that it's the holidays and we're doing this remotely and talking about people losing weight. There was a fascinating, article in the Wall Street Journal about the president of Belarus who is trying to do a deal to come out from under sanctions. He refers to himself as the only dictator left in Europe. And John Cole, who is known to both of us, has been doing the, negotiations between America and Polaris. But, what's fascinating about this is that the president recognized that John Cole had lost some weight, which in fact, you can tell in the photos of him recently. And he admitted he was on Zep bound, one of the GOP ones. And it now looks like one of the deals is going to be around the fact that they can get him some GLP one so he too could lose weight. Now, John Cole, this is it's interesting. 11:02 A minor note here is the husband of Greta Van Susteren. Correct. Who is the, the old Fox News? Well, she became a she was a legal analyst on Fox News. And then she got a, a primetime or maybe the 7:00, anchor slot. Very popular for, for, for quite some time. And Cole's lawyer, has become, Yeah, a, a kind of a significant unknown but significant Trump adviser. So he was brought in, and during the campaign, I kind of tracked his, his whereabouts because he was always brought in to all of the debate prep sessions. Interesting. And, of course, he made his money. I used to know them at one point, and, And we've slightly lost touch there. 12:01 I must get back in touch. But he was known as. I think he was the first lawyer that got one of the really enormous settlements in the tobacco cases. So every year he gets an absolutely ginormous check, and they have an absolutely beautiful boat, which was the, sister boat to the honey Fitz that the the Kennedy said. Honey, Fitz was John of Kennedy's grandfather. Of course. Okay. Thank you for for putting that. But they have a. And the former mayor of and a former mayor of Boston. Right, right. Okay. We're slightly digressed. We've slightly digressed, except I just told me this before. Before we leave. Before we leave, John, John calls just to, give him some props here. He had a terrible fight during one of these debate prep debate prep sessions with Stephen Miller. And John Coles was on the side, relatively speaking, to the extent that anyone can be in Trump world on the side of the angels. 13:07 And Stephen Miller was, of course, the absolute, Antichrist. Well, it's taking on from Antichrist. We could note that the cabinet Christmas cards this year have been unusually religious. You know, I wonder I mean, there is a point here. So so this is not just like, I mean, let's let's be a little more Christmasy. I mean, these are these are these greetings from Hegseth and Christy. Noam, these great Christians of our time. Are kind of extraordinary, certainly, certainly over the top. And and make that assumption that this is a Christian nation. And we are all, 14:04 celebrating the birth of our Savior and the government of the United States is, is, is is involved with that celebration of the birth of Jesus Christ, which is, of course. Not, ours. A whole bunch of people have pointed out, this is, pretty unusual, if not downright un-American. So what's the point of this? Yeah. It's nothing. You know, I mean. I, you know, I mean, the point is, again, this this very concerted bow to this to, a a bulwark of the of the conservative Trump movement, which is evangelical America. Right? And Christian nationalism as seen through the eyes of Erica Kirk now and obviously her former husband Charlie Kirk. 15:01 And, you know, I say this as someone who joyfully went to a Christmas Eve mass and, belted out the Christmas carols at the top of my voice. But there is something ominous, almost threatening, about the message coming out from Pete Hegseth. Today we celebrate the birth of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. Pete Hegseth wrote. I'm quoting from the New York Times here. May his light bring peace, hope, and joy to you and your families. But somehow it seemed ominous. And then Marco Rubio, the joyous message of Christmas is the hope of eternal life through Christ, Mr. Rubio said, which feels very religious for a secretary of state. Yeah, and of course, neither of these, of these two men wrote these posts themselves. They ordered this up and said, give us go over, go over the top on on. Christ. Just just, you know, lay it out there. Make it, make it go full. Jesus. They would have said. Yeah. And joy to the world. The US Department of Labor put out a joy to the world, 16:02 sort of Christmas post with let earth receive her king. And again, it just sort of a card full of of white people and harking back to a fantasy of America that never was, but of children's books. So at any rate, we know, and certainly Donald Trump was not in a candlelight service on Christmas Eve. So what was he doing? This is what I'm trying to imagine. Donald Trump's Christmas morning. You wake up, many, many people. The traditional Christmas morning is you wake up with your with your family and exchange gifts. Can we see Donald Trump in that setting? All right. Well, no we cannot. No we cannot. So what do we think that he did? Did he have a Christmas breakfast. Today of of Christmas book. Well, I think he was watching television. Right. 17:05 He wakes up and his banks of televisions are still going because he didn't switch them off the night before. Unless someone slips into his room and switches them off for him. But we know he did. He coming. This is his bedroom door. So, he's he's also been up half the night. Truth social, as you say. Put out 100 posts. So he's in a a sort of post through social sweat. And so wakes up. Yeah, I know that's where he is. Do you think just you do think it takes him a couple of seconds to re orientate himself? Well, I don't know. I mean, he's only ever two places. It's not as if this is, it's a it's a confusing schedule for him. He's he's in, in the white House or he's in Mar-A-Lago. He's in Mar-A-Lago. And I think they're probably both very, very similar. I think I think he he arranges these things to basically look the same. 18:04 And, and he does the same thing. So he got, he gets, he gets up and, and he starts. What's the most important thing to Donald Trump? What is his life line calls. He makes calls. He makes hoax. Calls and he makes calls and, and, you know, he gets on the phone and he says, what's happening? How's it playing? And well, which is all, which is all, all a invitation to talk about him. Of course. Correct. Do you think people will have told him the truth about the ratings for the Kennedy Center Honors, which he emceed this year? And he opened with a 12 minute speech, which CBS and this is significant, obviously, because of their, they're owned by David Allison as part of Paramount, and they're part of the deal for Warner 19:03 Brothers, which I want you to come on to and give us an update with. But, CBS put out it's televised, Kennedy Center Honors, without mentioning the fact that Trump has changed the name to the Trump Kennedy Center Honors, and the Trump Kennedy Center. And sadly, it had a 35% dip in ratings from the previous year. You know, the thing about television ratings is they're they're they're they're broken down into such increments that you can always find good news. So someone would have gone through this and said, we are up in the So 18 to 24 hours. Oh, well, they're probably not up to 18 to 20. Maybe they're up in the sort of 75 to 85, you know, seating counties. Yes. Some in permit. They would have they would have found they only good. 20:03 They certainly would not have gone to Trump and, to announce that, terrible ratings in that, in that the show, the show that he had emceed the this, his, his, his dream, I am the emcee of a network show. Actually, he sort of was the emcee of a network. Of. 14, many, many years. That he may miss it. He may miss it. I'm sure he does. But they would not have told them that this was, you were, that it was a flop, which it was. So I wonder how how does David Ellison react to the fact that they didn't call it the Trump Kennedy Center, and that they cut the president's 12 minute speech down to two minutes? Given that he's hustling as hard as he possibly can for Paramount to take over Warner Brothers discovery, which is up for sale. Okay. And let's the I mean, the the context here, there are two bidders for Warner Brothers discovery. 21:05 There is Netflix, who is now the top bidder and and has the the accepted bid. Warner Brothers discovery has announced that they will be sold to Netflix. Paramount. And the Ellison family has made a hostile offer, which is to say they have gone directly to the Warner Warner Brothers discovery shareholders and said our offer is better and our offer is better, not least of all because we will have our offer approved by the Trump administration and the FCC, where as Netflix will be tied down in regulatory issues for the foreseeable future. So that's the that's the that's the lay of the land at the moment. 22:00 In order, though, to pull this off, of course, the Ellison's have to continue to curry favor with Donald Trump, but they have to curry favor with Donald Trump at the same time not making themselves into a universal laughing stock. Now, the other, the other day, they canceled a segment on 60 minutes about immigration, which would have likely offended the Trump administration, and that has now put them in the crosshairs and made them not only a laughing stock, but but, but seem to be an utter dupes of the Trump administration. Therefore, therefore, they now have to lean over in other ways not to be perceived as just lackeys, Donald Trump's lackeys. 23:02 Well, and David Ellison, son of Oracle founder Larry Ellison, says that his father, the. Second richest man in the world. Second richest man in the world, his his father will backstop this personally with 40, I think. I think he said $44 billion. What does that actually mean? Well, he. Said, I mean, I think I. It well. Yes, that that's the language that they use a personal that he will personally guarantee. We don't know what that means. I mean, a personal guarantee. In, in a, in a technical technical terms was, is that you put up the following collateral against this. And if for some reason you renege on, on this, this debt, well, you know, tough luck and we come and take your property and, and that's and that's it. We don't know if that's if that's actually what's, what's going on. And it just could be a personal guarantee. 24:03 I personally guarantee it. And so, you know. Putting it with his, islands in Hawaii. Yeah. Well, or or. You know, why? Islands or nothing. Just there. Trust me. Yes, I guarantee it. Trust me. So. So we don't know. Is Trump in a difficult situation here because we know that Ted Sarandos, the co-CEO of Netflix, went to see Trump and Trump gave him a favorable report. But we also know that he's, he's, that that Larry Ellison is part of the tick tock deal that Donald Trump has brokered. So and we know that at one point, Jared Kushner, Trump's son in laws, private equity company affinity Partners was going to be part of the Ellison deal. Then he dropped out. So if you had to put money on this at this point, who would you say? And just part of the background 25:01 here is that is that all three companies Paramount, Netflix, Warner Brothers, discovery have hired virtually anyone they possibly can in the Trump orbit to advise them. So it's only Pete's advisors. A law, a long list of of of Trumpers trying to well, each of them trying to make money off of off of this, this deal. But, but with their function being to represent what each company's interests to the president of the United States. And and who said he wants to be involved in the decision to. Yeah. No, I. Think. I think I think what you're seeing is an auction. Now. Now, in theory, this should be the company that should win this deal is the company that should offer the shareholders of Warner Brothers discovery the most money. 26:05 That's how that's how mergers and acquisitions work. That's how, ultimately, a hostile takeover. The only way a hostile takeover works. I'm offering more money. Therefore the shareholders should vote for for us. But there's a third in this deal, a third element, and it is. Who is going to offer the best deal to Donald Trump. So. Right. That's so I think I think that's what's going on. Right. Right now Trump is conducting an auction. And and it will be, you know, does does paramount, does does Paramount deliver something, advantageous to Trump or does Netflix deliver something even more advantageous to him? And of course, what's fascinating the media is the character of Barry Weiss, 27:00 who squeezed in the middle here between her own, David Ellison, who bought her own startup, the Free Press, installed her as editor in chief of news. And, of course, she made the decision to, to drop the segment about, America sending people to the jail in El Salvador, under the pretext that they didn't have anybody from the government speaking to defend, the policy. Which. No. Well, unfortunately, people have been saying including the producer of the segment, this is a political decision. Yeah. Well, understand, I mean, so she took this job. I mean, the terms of the job to be to be the head of a news division of a major network, the assumption there has always been, yes, you have to you have to have a relationship and you're going to have to negotiate with, with, with the suits, the suits who are, 28:04 who you ultimately report to. Right. But but also with a great degree of independence. I mean, it's somewhat like the independence that one assumed if one became the attorney general of the United States and ran the Justice Department, you had yes. You had a relationship with the president of the United States? Yes. There were political concerns and issues, but nevertheless, you have you had, your independence was largely guaranteed by tradition, if not statute. And sometimes statute. And that was that's the same as a director of a network news division. Your responsibility is in your primary responsibility is to the news rather than to corporate interests. Now, this is a fine line, and it's and and many 29:05 it has been crossed many times in many instances. And and it always is kind of difficult to sustain, but in some measure it has been sustained. Barry Weiss, however, comes into this job knowing that, that her independence is substantially more circumscribed then probably any other, that the head of any other news division. And in fact, that's one of the reasons she gets the job. She has never run a news division. She has she has never worked in television. She doesn't know any of the, she she doesn't come into this job equipped with any kind of of, of experience that would allow her to 30:00 to capably defend herself. Well, that's that's the deal. And and the deal is understanding that the Ellison's own this lock, stock and barrel, it's their money. It's their place. It's not an issue of shareholders. It's not an issue of of a network that has that has, that has a long tradition. That tradition ended with the Ellison's the Ellison's took over. It's their money. And she would have known that the Ellison's are in this battle and and their allegiance is to. In order for them to win this battle, they have to cultivate Donald Trump. Therefore, therefore, it's, it's it's it's just almost inconceivable why Barry Weiss or anyone would have taken this job. Except that people are. You can say that. 31:01 You might say they are ever optimistic or they are wholly craven. What was fascinating about the decision to pull the segment from 60 minutes is that no one was paying attention to the fact that it aired in Canada. I mean, again, sort of in experience, in understanding how these things work. So the show that was essentially banned in North America becomes available in Canada, ergo, it's available anywhere you want to see it online. So Paramount's been rushing around trying to close it down, but once the cat's out of the bag. No. And I an I would imagine that, that Barry Weiss and I would imagine she's she's pretty alarmed about what happened. What has happened now. And I imagine the way it happened is that she got a call and it's not impossibly. The call was directly from David Ellison. 32:01 And he said, you know, get rid of this. What are you doing? Well, they've been saying it all over social media. Yes, he may well be it. Yes. And he probably raised his voice, and he probably was pretty unpleasant about the whole thing. I have had those calls from from magazine executives when they've seen pieces that they weren't comfortable going out. So I'm sympathetic to Barry and they. And they are never Nick and they are never pleasant. Those calls. And now it's on. It's on Barry Weiss she is the, her credibility, which she didn't have to begin with and I, I guess was conscious that she had the build up has now taken, to say the least, a substantial hit. And I think it's also the nature of the job. Right. CBS news has gone through six heads of news in the last six years. 33:00 So it's not a job with, with long standing potential necessarily. Yeah, I mean, I can I again, I can't imagine why anyone would take these take this, this job, which is a whole, a whole kind of a subtext of many jobs. Why would anyone take a job in the Trump White House, for instance? Knowing that that if you if you look, I mean, we're not talking ideology here. We're, we're talking careers looking at all of the, pretty much 100% of the parts of the personnel in Trump's political life they have that has all for everyone come to, to, some form of ignominy. It's very hard at this point not to bring up the specter of Rex Tillerson, who was, you know, famously the CEO of Exxon and who, in fact, when he took over as secretary of state, 34:03 I think with full sincerity, expecting to be able to do the job, ended up being fired as he was sitting on the loo. You know, again, again and again. You know, McMasters, who was that, Goldman Sachs guy whose name now I can't remember. Which Goldman Sachs, Gary Cohn. Gary. Gary revived. Gary Cohn survived though he was one of the few. And Steve Mnuchin survived the finance guy. Well. I don't think Gary Cohn survived. How how can you say that he was he was treated miserably. Insulted constantly. And and ultimately pushed out. And and you know. He survived to tell another tale. Gary cohn and also he emerged as a slight hero because he was the guy that kept taking pieces of paper off Trump's desk so that Trump wouldn't know these things, these issues even. Well, I mean, Gary Cohn has has gone on to try 35:06 to justify this and to make himself into into a hero. So if we think. Of okay, fair. As a hero, it's only because Gary Cohn has said he's a hero. But other people more objectively would say Gary Cohn was a classic Trump overreach or and dupe fair. And he took the job because he knew he wasn't going to get CEO of Goldman Sachs. And and where is he now? Where is a man, a man without portfolio? Aren't we all? So we've managed to get this far without mentioning your favorite person, Jeffrey Epstein. And where are we on the Epstein files? We've still got incredibly, a million files still to drop. Whatever the files are, whatever the files are. And what are they? At this point, we have no idea. 36:01 We we have. We have no idea. Here. I mean, this this, I mean, this announcement. And it was oddly phrased, and we've discovered a new million files. And what is a million files means it means million documents. Who counted them? Who, who? You know, there there is a thing, I mean, there I think there are, there are, there are two themes which we ought to keep our eye on here. The one of them being that, that I think the strand, the, the, the clear cut strategy of the Trump might, white House might have been just to we're going to, you know, we're stuck here. We got, you know, our Republican allies screwed us. They voted for this, you know, this release the files business and, and we don't really know what is in them. 37:00 And we can't really know. So the way we're going to deal with this is just is just a dump, to release this stuff in such a chaotic, disorganized manner that by the time people figure out what's in the headlines, will the moment will have passed, the headlines will have will have passed, and we will we will deal with this all later on. There's just too much here for anyone to come up with. A cogent picture of what? Of of what happened or and even any one specific instance of what happened versus so many other instances or half instances. And we don't even know if each individual document is a true document or not. We've already seen many things that are that are, that are at best implausible. 38:01 So the weird thing is the faked some of the fake documents are getting as much attention as the real documents, which is bizarre. But we do know that the FBI have been working overtime. It a desperate call beseeching, agents to work extra over the holidays went out because there's so much to redact. And we also know that this being Trump's DOJ, that there is a level of incompetence in the redacting, which online hackers quickly discovered that if you just take the document that's been redacted and put in Microsoft Word that it's unredacted, right? Which which is another story that does actually doesn't that that, something else that yet distracts from this, from the, the, the import of of of this overall picture or the specific aspects of this overall picture. We don't know what's going on here. Everything just part of the chaos. Now, there's another part of this to another thematic part that I think 39:08 I think we ought to think about, which is that this idea of the very idea of release the files, I mean, that has become this thing that release the files, and then we will know what we don't know, release the files and all mysteries will be cleared up. Release the files. And every conspiracy that we have imagined will be revealed. Release. And this turns out to be as we might have imagined, with any kind of kind of forethought. Ridiculous. I mean, it means nothing. Release the files means nothing means that you're going to have have, a a a sea of of unvetted information, a sea of disorganized information, a sea of contradictory information that will answer nothing. 40:06 So, and you made the point that if there was an official investigation into the files, they would have had to be pre sorted and put under themes or subject matter or whatever. What is the answer to this now? Because nobody is going to know a single person is going to be able to go through every single file. I'm sure that the big news organizations have got teams who are working on it. But how how should people approach this at this point? You know, I don't know. And and even, you know, it should be said that even official investigations don't necessarily solve this, this problem. And we can go back there. It was the Warren Commission. You can't get more of an official investigatory body than that. And all that ultimately accomplished is to is to define all of the parameters of, 41:07 of the limitations of an investigation and of the holes in what we did not know. And so therefore, all of these years later, we have we in fact, we set up the paradigm for the for for the central conspiracy of our time and the model for all conspiratorial thinking. That didn't answer the question. And I don't know what the answer to the question, how do you solve a mystery? I don't know, Well, we do know. And it also is, you know, particularly suited to, I mean, a particular problem when often when there is no mystery to solve or when you think a mystery is much greater than what is in front of your face. 42:05 You know, I mean, the Jeffrey, the the mystery here is that we assume Jeffrey Epstein was at the center of a, of a worldwide conspiracy. That that he was that he trafficked girls for the purpose of controlling powerful men. I mean, I think that is the the underlying assumption here. Oh, that he was Donald Trump's closest friend for at least 10 or 15 years, that the two of them hunted women together. And Donald Trump has denied that friendship and said that it was completely overplayed. No. And then we we we should look, I mean, I think I think so far what do we what do we know here? And among the things that we certainly know is that Donald Trump's friendship with Jeffrey Epstein was much closer 43:03 than than anything he has ever represented, and that it probably that it certainly crossed over that, that, that Donald Trump was involved with. I'm trying to be careful here in, in Donald Trump was involved in Jeffrey Epstein's lifestyle. Well, they hung out with models together. I mean, you're always talking about the models was the currency of the time. Successful men displayed their success by being surrounded by models. So to look, I mean, the questions are still and we might as well what did what did Donald Trump know about what Jeffrey Epstein was up to? When did he know it? In the meantime, we have, an email from 44:03 Andrew, formerly known as Prince Andrew, to Glenn Maxwell, which I thought would be worth reading out because it gives you an insight into the British royal family, which is, you know, I, I, I'm not obsessed with it, but I'm curious about anything that gives us insight into actually how they live and think as opposed to what we were fed, by the palace officials. But I thought it's not a very long one, but I thought I'd read this out. It's sent on the 16th of August, 2001. I'm up here at Balmoral Summer camp for the Royal family. Balmoral is this huge gray castle in Scotland that the Queen was said to like. Best of all, her royal residences and my experience of having spent a lot of time up in that area in Scotland is it's constantly raining. There's a there's a threat that hangs over, almost all of Scotland for most of the summer anyway. Activities take place all day and I'm totally exhausted at the end of each day. 45:00 The girls, that's Eugenie and Beatrice. His daughters are completely shattered, and I will have to give them an early night today as it is getting tiring splitting them up all the time. How's LA? Which is obviously where Glen was living. Have you found me some new inappropriate friends? Let me know when you were coming over as I am free from the 25th of August until the 2nd of September, I want to go somewhere hot and sunny with some fun people before having to put my nose firmly to the grindstone for the fall. Any ideas? Gratefully received. See you a. It's just a. First. Let's let's run it. What did, What do you think Andrew's Christmas was like? Well, I think it was probably his last Christmas in Royal Lodge, so. Not good. And his brother, the King, was roundly criticized for putting Eugenie, Princesses Eugenie and Beatrice 46:00 very prominently in the Christmas Sandringham. The royal family go to church on Christmas morning. It's always televised and very prominently there. There was no sign of Andrew. The two princesses were were front and center, which caused an uproar in Britain. They were furious about it because they feel that they're part of Prince Andrew's grift. So they they the the, the the popular view was that they should also be wiped out of this. Yeah. The popular because that's scrubbed that scrubbed, scrubbed from the royal list. Scrubbed from getting free apartments for peppercorn rents, as they're called, in Kensington Palace. I believe. So this it backfired the decision to, I think, say that the children are not of the man, as it were, and that they have independent lives and 47:01 as far as we know, are perfectly decent girls. I've met Beatrice a few times. She seems utterly pleasant and hardworking. Shouldn't be penalized for the sins of the father. At some point. Let's have a discussion. I'm not sure how interesting that would be, but nevertheless, is is Andrew what has happened to Andrew a greater threat to the monarchy than than, Charles's divorce from Diana and Diana's then, media campaign against him? Well, it's very interesting question. Because people are less tolerant of of the monarchy now and Andrew's foibles, including one weekend where he went through apparently 40 prostitutes in Thailand while he was on official business for his mother. I think are much more egregious, obviously, than than Charles 48:01 apparently continuing a relationship with the woman that is now going. Now, now, now we see that as much as, as, less egregious. But then in the, in the innocent 1990s, that was, that that seemed to be pretty perilous for Charles and for the monarchy. Yes, I think that's true. And then Diana's death was also perilous. Do you remember the moment when the Queen had to come out and stand in front of Buckingham Palace and curtsy as the, funeral cortege passed by? I remember, I remember less the moment than the movie about the moment. Well, I might be remembering that, too. I mean, there's the Crown and then there's the movie. What was the movie called? The The Crown? The brilliant Netflix series by Peter Morgan. And then there was the movie. I can't remember what the movie was called. What was that movie called in which? Just the Queen. Yes, it was and Tony. Tony Blair was the was the primary figure in that. 49:04 And I think in. That movie, and he was the. Mess he played by Michael Sheen. I well, I can see him clearly and I know that actor, and I would recognize that actor anywhere, but I don't know his name. I think it was Michael Sheen is a very good movie, and there's a great moment where there's just a stag standing on its own at the top of the hill, which seemed to carry a lot of resonance anyway. But he was something to watch this holiday season. And that's. It. Just just that guy, the guy who played that role. He was the emcee of the GQ man of the year awards when I got it, man of the year award, along with then the then Prince Charles. Oh, is that right? Says you and Prince Charles shared a stage. Did he turn up? He did. He did. And we had a, we had a conversation. What did you like with you? That you really buried the lead here? Yes, please. 50:07 Michael Sheen, it's Michael Sheen. I was just checking. Okay. Yes. Okay. Go ahead. This is my shared stage with Prince Charles, and this is no more. And this is what Prince Charles said to me as follows. He looked at me up and down and then said, I know your tailor. What a great line. That's fantastic that he recognized. Do you want to give your tailor shout out. I why not? It's Anderson and Shepard up. A, Sounds pretty. Very, very respected London tailor. Who? Charles. And also Charles's tailor. By special appointment. By royal appointment. We've given great recommendations for holiday viewing. The Mar-A-Lago videos or, the Queen or the Crown. 51:04 And you can look at it through the Epstein lens now. I mean, they may have to do another spin off of The Crown, which is just under the falling crown. The broken crown and suits. We know we can we can record. We can recommend a, a really choice brand of. Oh, I thought you meant the TV show suits. And I was like, what? Because it's got Meghan Markle, which is another part of the. No. My classmates and Charles's suits. Okay. All right. Okay. Well, Michael, happy holidays. We've got lots in store for people next week. Very exciting. We've got a two parter on Jeffrey Epstein's relationship with Donald Trump, where we go back to the beginning and really chronicle, the chronology. I guess, of. Yeah. So forget it. Forget you. I forget the files. The millions have come. This is this is all you need to know. This is all you need to know. And also just reminding you there are very few seats 52:04 left for the 21st of January. 92nd Street Y on the Upper East Side of Manhattan, where you can come and see Michael and I discussing live. Whatever. I guess the news of the week will be. And I will be wearing an Anderson and Shepard suit. And I will not be wearing an Anderson Intrepid suit. I've no idea what I will be wearing, but I'm glad you've given sufficient thought to it. And I guess we'll also be talking about. It will be a year to the day since Donald Trump was inaugurated. We'll be talking about what his first year has been like and. A year to the day, plus one. Year to the day plus one, and the decision of all those business people to appear in the inauguration quite as prominently as they did Jeff Bezos, Tim Cook, Sergei Brin, Mark Zuckerberg. And are they regretting that now? And are they regretting that now? 53:01 Well, happily, Jeff Bezos is enjoying himself with his big ten gallon cowboy hat in Aspen. And on that note. Happy holidays. Do we want to leave our, viewers and readers with a religious message? We do not. We believe in the in the in the separation of church and state. So if you have been thank you for joining us. Don't forget to subscribe to The Daily Beast for Independent Media. So we appreciate your support. You can be a beast tier member of community, which is actually kind of fun. And what else do we need to say, Michael? And we should thank our top level members. And they are Sandra Clark, methinks. Travel with Carl Andrew Beaver, the Kappa Nator, Harry Clark, Dawn McCarthy, Daniel Dog lover, M Greiner, Fulvia, Orlando, Herbie, Andrew. Miller, Lars. 54:05 Candy. Bonzo. Val. Love, Francesco. Andrea. Hotel Bo Kok DC, Sharon. Shipley, Connie. Rutherford, Karen. White, Heidi. Riley. Thank you all. Devin and, And Jesse. We are in your debt.

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