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COMMENTARY THE COFFEE KLATCH ... JULY 5TH 2025 with Robert Reich and Heather Lofthouse Fascism On The Fourth PLAY YOUTUBE VIDEO Original article: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yc4xl3nz_Ac
Fascism On The Fourth \| The Coffee Klatch with Robert Reich Robert Reich 1.26M subscribers ... 246,876 views ... 13K likes Premiered Jul 5, 2025 The Coffee Klatch with Robert Reich The Big Ugly Bill throws millions off Medicaid and SNAP, gives ICE more money than most militaries, and makes the wealthiest households in America even richer. Heather and I break it all down on today's Klatch. How this content was made Auto-dubbed Audio tracks for some languages were automatically generated. Learn more Peter Burgess COMMENTARY DELAYED Peter Burgess Transcript 0:02 And it is the Saturday coffee clutch with Heather Loft House. Hello. And yours truly, Robert Brush. Heather, what are we going to talk about today? Well, the big ugly bill that just passed. Wait, and all the implications of it. I I think this is just absolutely not just awful. This is a disgrace. An utter utter disgrace. The fact that we have this bill um coming at us. The American people are going to have to struggle under the consequences of this bill. And let's be clear what the consequences are. We've talked about this a little bit in the past. Oh, I miss Central Park already. I do. I'm just sitting here thinking, you know, it was last week. We were sitting on a park bench. It was pretty blissful. Beautiful. Uh you know, Manny had had just been, you know, basically almost elected. I know. We had the birds and that squirrel and that squirrel. And here we are back in America. It feels 1:02 like we're we're in California, but it feels like we're under siege. And this bill um is sort of a an indication of the siege that we are all under. Uh it takes at least a trillion dollars out of Medicaid. It takes uh a big chunk out of food stamps, a big chunk out of nutrition assistance. Uh, and what does it do? It gives the richest people in America a huge tax cut. Another huge tax cut. As if the richest need needed another huge tax cut. I mean, we've talked about on this program uh that we're at near record levels of inequality in terms of income and wealth in this country already. And I want to get into this with you because another feature of this bill is that it puts huge funding, huge resources into anti-immigrant surveillance and detention. Uh turning 2:03 potentially turning America into an anti-immigrant police state. But how much money are we talking? I mean, I don't think the news is has been covering the scale of what we're talking. It hasn't. Uh, Heather, I mean, first of all, people don't understand the scale of this money anyway. I mean, adding and I've I forgot to mention over $3 trillion to the national debt in addition to everything else. Um, it it's it's probably the antithesis, this bill, of good government or where this country ought to be heading. How about limited government? Uh, it's not limited in any way. Uh, in fact, it's the antithesis of what Republicans have been talking about for years. uh but uh your point about the scale I think it's very hard for most people to understand what a trillion dollars or what two trillion or what three tr three adding $3 trillion to the national debt uh actually amounts to. Um let's start with the national debt. Do you mind? Oh, this 3:04 is this is what I've been waiting for. Oh, let me get my let me get my coffee. Go. Well, uh, look, uh, you add $3.3 trillion to the national debt. We don't have the exact figure, but it's somewhere in that neighborhood. Um, and you you have a debt that is significantly higher than the total yearly national product uh of the United States. Um, and the problem ultimately with that degree of debt is that you are causing global bond holders of the United States to get nervous. They're charging more to lend money to the United States. And a lot of these people are Americans. They're very rich Americans mostly. They are also lending money to the United States to cover this debt. Uh and that means interest rates, particularly long-term interest interest rates go up. That means people have to pay more for mortgages and auto loans. Uh it's a 4:04 hidden price increase, a hidden inflationary increase uh that all of us have to pay. And meanwhile, the value of the dollar is going down because everybody around the world says to themselves, well, I can't trust the United States uh to maintain its fiscal integrity. Right now, that's the least problematic part of this bill. U I find honestly the notion that we're taking a trillion or more dollars out of Medicaid and giving it to rich people effectively and reverse Robin Hood. It's reverse Robin Hood, but it's reverse Robin Hood in very particularly and a very cruel way. Uh the the benefits in terms of the tax benefits happen earlier. they will happen almost immediately. Uh the rich will get even more of a tax benefit than they have already. But the costs in 5:02 terms of the Medicaid reductions, the 11 and we don't know whether it's 11 million or 11.5 million people who would be losing their health care coverage. Who are those people? Can you just give us a sense? Well, um they are lower income. They are not all poor. I mean they're lower income workingass. They are overwhelmingly white. And where are they? And they are in red states. Uh on average. Yeah. Yeah. On average, I mean there's some obviously in California, New York, many uh but you have a lot of them who are going to be suffering in red states uh that are represented by the same people who voted for this bill. Uh that's one of the great ironies in this bill and I think it's one of the reasons that a lot of Republicans didn't want to go along with it. Uh both, you know, you also had the Freedom Caucus, you had the Republicans didn't want to add to the national debt. You had that two groups of Republicans. how they got together finally and made a deal uh is 6:05 is a is an interesting historians will look at this as not only Trump's power but his exercise of almost authoritarian in fact it's not almost it's authoritarian power um to threaten these legislators um threaten them with being primared in the next election Tom of North Carolina. He said, 'Okay, I'm leaving. I'm just leaving. I'm not even I'm not going to stick around.' Um, so you have this threat. You also have an implicit threat to many of the legislators, uh, that the the vigilantes of Trump, the, you know, he, you know, the the violent prone Trump followers are going to take it out on some of the legislators that actually don't go along. This is not that far removed, Heather, from what we saw in the 1930s. 7:01 No, mostly in Germany, but we saw elsewhere in the 1930s. Um, so you have these legislators, Republicans, intimidated, fear, fearful that they're going to be primar. They go along at the at the 11th hour. Um and you also have at the same time and this is what is not getting enough play in the press. you have huge amounts of money going into surveillance technology uh the the so-called wall on the southern the southern border and detention facilities uh for migrants all detentions facilities all over the country like the the alligator what was Alcatraz in the Everglades uh that that Trump is just loves the idea that that there there alligators and crocodiles all around the but to be clear the amount that is in this bill for these 8:00 detention centers and this process of detaining is more than the budget that was USAD's total budget. Yes, it's more than the entire budget of the federal prison system. Uh it is a huge amount of money going into again we're talking about just detention centers. uh not even mentioning all of the surveillance and the the wall and and all of the additional uh maintenance of of the southern border. So what's that aligned with? I mean is this like a war budget? I mean this seems it it it is in a sense a war budget. I mean this is the danger here and let's be very very clear. The danger here is that we tip over into giving Trump and the Department of Homeland Security and ICE the kind of powers that we reserve during wartime. Uh and you remember some of the terrible things the United States has done during 9:00 the Second World War uh putting Japanese Americans into detention camps. Well, when you have internment camps, detention camps, and they're going to be all over America, and they are large, uh obviously they're going to be used. Yeah. When you have ICE becoming an an army in and of itself, it's going to be used. And another analogy, too, or fact is that that detention budget that's in this bill is bigger than NIH, CDC, and cancer research. what was cut for all of them combined. Yeah. I think this is this is extremely important because the press has been focusing on Yes. cuts in Medicaid, very very important. Cuts in food stamps, terrible, devastating. Yeah. Uh and and and the debt uh national debt increasing and all of the you know the problems with regard to giving the the rich a huge increase in in in their tax benefits. That's all true. But this part that we're now talking about, the police state that 10:04 comes out of this, uh, is in some senses the most dangerous and most devastating. But so you talked about all of these Republicans who are saluting and doing what they're supposed to do, right? They're ignoring their constituents and they are going along with Trump, but they're not cowering in a corner. I mean you saw this yesterday that they are in line getting signed merch. You mean from the White House? Yes. But so what does what is that description of you know I think there there are several things going on at the same time. The Republican party is gone. I mean let's we've c we've talked about this before but this is the the the final piece of evidence. There is no longer a Republican party. Uh it is a Trump cult. It is a Trump posi. Uh it is uh it is basically lining up entirely behind the strong man the leader and it's so sophomoric and it's so materialistic that these people but also sophomoric 11:03 materialistic I think that you put your finger exactly but Bob to have this man I mean it's so infantilizing as well right to have this big the daddy the king daddy of the white house and now they're doing and then they get in line to get signed merch What is happening? Well, but see, I think the infantilizing is is kind of an interesting concept because you've got this man in the White House who wants to create and has spent years creating the illusion of being all powerful and and basically extraordinary uh you know potent and and somebody that that has no weakness whatsoever. And you have one of his techniques is to make others people feel that they are children and that they are uh kind of reliant on him totally dependent on him. uh and this is an old-fashist technique that we've saw this again and again in the 30s uh Mussolini and Hitler and Franco and 12:06 others and Stalin the this is what we and more recently Orban and others and Victor Orban is certainly this is out of his playbook as well. Uh and so Donald Trump has turned the Republican party into a bunch of infants essentially dependent on him completely dependent on him. uh and more interested in his approval and getting and and avoiding his wrath than they are interested in the approval of their constituents. Well, what's what's interesting is the timing on all of this, right? So, when do these cuts take place relative to the midterms? It's not all going to happen on Monday morning, right? Well, this is also important. It happens. The cuts in Medicaid and in food stamps uh and in nutrition assistance, they happen after the 2026 midterm elections. Oh, that's convenient. Yes, it's very convenient 13:00 because a lot of the people who are going to be hurt the most who are, as we talked about, Republican constituents, they are not going to wake up to the fact that they are hurt uh until after they have voted in the midterms. And there's a difference between knowing you're going to be hurt and feeling the hurt, including as you go to the ballot box. Well, exactly. And Republicans are going to be saying to them over and over again, look, uh, there was fraud and waste in Medicaid, uh, and putting a work requirement on Medicaid is only fair. People should work for whatever they get. Uh, what Republicans will not be saying to their constituents is you are going to lose your health coverage. And the reason you're going to lose your health coverage is because many of you are unable to work and many of you are unable to do the paperwork that is required to continue to stay on Medicaid. Uh and many of you are dependent on food stamps and you are not going to get any goodbye. Uh there are 14:00 you know you my constituents I know and you know you are more vulnerable today. You are living paycheck to paycheck. You may not even be living uh paycheck to paycheck. Uh the minimum wage has sunk to almost nothing uh in many states. You are people who voted for Trump because you thought that he was going to bring prices down. He was going to make things affordable for you. He was going to make your life better. and you are actually now facing a life that is worse because you're going to have to pay more for health care and for food and for everything else. And we haven't even talked about the the Trump tariffs and what they're going to do to prices. Uh so Republicans are essentially and Republican office holders have become zombies in this Trump army. And I haven't really witnessed anything quite as dangerous. 15:01 You and I have been talking uh about about Trump and about his goings on for many many years and we've looked at the first three months and the first 100 days. Uh Trump is now flirting with a total dict dictatorial fascism. So I want to talk about that and what stage are we in? Because I met someone recently who said we're not on the brink. We're in it. We're in the midst of it. So that's what's the it fascism. Well, there's no official definition of when we tip into do like this. No, we can't. We can't. But I I think we're very close if we're not into it right now because all of the essentials are there. That is intimidating the universities, intimidating law firms, uh going after every media outlet that is uh in any way, um criticizing you, uh 16:00 going after the courts, u arresting even individual judges, uh making uh judges fear fear fearful for their lives. Um and then on top of all of this establishing the mechanisms of a police state, right? Um the surveillance technologies that are in the bill and are being funded in this new big awful bad horrible bill. Exactly. Yeah. Uh and the detention facilities. So there is no disscent allowed. There is no critical thinking allowed. I mean, it's coming at all of these levels to just he just wants zombies saluting. And remember, he was elected not by a majority. I'm talking about Donald Trump. It was elected by a plurality. And it was a small, it was one and a half%. This bill gets through the House and the Senate by the 17:00 smallest. I mean, you know, JD Vance had to go to the Senate to cast the deciding vote because it was 50/50. In the House, you you have a a tiny tiny tiny uh majority. I know, but he commands as though it's a mandate and people think it's a mandate. Exactly. He takes any uh advantage he can of there being a so-called mandate. He creates the impression and he's a con man. I mean, we we've seen this. We know this. This is not new. Uh but he is taking his conman uh act to a new level and this police state really enables him. It does uh because it enables him to not only keep the pressure on the scapegoats who are you know these the puditive hordes of people coming. Steven Miller wants 3,000 arrested. Steven Miller does want he that's his goal. He stayed at 3,000 a day. he wants uh arrested, detained and 18:02 eventually deported and eventually deported. Also, the economy can't can't take it. I mean, this is, you know, if you're looking at estimates of the number of American workers who are here uh who are undocumented, we're talking about 5% of the entire American workforce. Heather, uh they are also consumers. uh they are not taking Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security because they they're not eligible for Medicaid, Medicare or Social Security. So, they're putting money into all of these public programs. They are buying things. They're their buying power is very very important. Uh and employers need them particularly in the agricultural sector and in the hospitality sector and they are now vulnerable. The other thing that we have to recognize, Trump was saying, it's just going to be criminals who are going to be deported. And some of the some of the Trump followers think it's just criminals. No, the deportations now are anybody anybody who does not have full 19:06 citizenship, even green card holders. Some of them are being detained. And you have some Americans, some people who are citizens who are being detained because they get caught up in the drag net. And how are they going to prove what needs to be proved? And are you worried that number is going to increase naturalized citizens? Because well, because it's going to obviously it's going to increase. I mean, when you have a an army, an internal army that is designed to root out X, whatever X is, uh, and you have detention facilities already set up, camps, uh, again, this the parallels with Nazi Germany are extraordinary. And uh yes, I I am worried uh that this gives Trump even more ability to intimidate, frighten uh and uh and and basically use fear with regard to a lot of this population. And 20:05 it's it's it's Americans. Any American who has brown skin is now likely to be stopped at some point by an immigration official, ICE agent, some sort of uh ICE police, and asked for his or her papers. Right. Right. Can I ask a question, please? So, Trump voters from last time, right? So, here they are. Now, I look in some of our we test our videos and you can see some comments where it's, you know, give him a chance. You know, he's not it's not as good as I hoped, but there's still time. This verdict is still out. You know, just don't diss him yet. And I have family members, you know, who are saying, you know, he's not, you know, this is not how I envisioned it. But, and so at what point do people say, I mean, it's hard for any of us to admit mistakes and that we were wrong. But at what point, if 21:02 it's not, if these, you know, cutting of snap doesn't hit by the time we get to the midterms, at what point is there going to be enough people that say, you know what, I don't actually like what's happening to our society. What? How do we get to that point? What What is the tipping point? I I don't know the answer to that. But what I tell myself uh in order to cheer myself up and me and us cuz we're here too is that there is going to be a tipping point because as we slide toward or already in fascism uh it forces people to take sides, right? I mean, you know, what are the sides? university presidents uh some of them like Colombia took the side of Trump. I mean so you know I we'll negotiate you we'll do whatever you want. Uh others like Harvard at least maintained some integrity. Uh law firms uh divided some law firms went along with Trump what what Trump was demanding. Uh some others 22:00 said no. Uh but imagine all of society as the vice gets tighter and tighter, as the fascist state becomes bolder and bolder, all of us will have to choose sides. All of us will have to be either the Neville Chamberlains of the American, you know, of facing facing Nazi Germany and capitulating and surrendering or we will be uh people like Joseph Welsh, you know, the people who stand up to tyranny and said as Joseph Welsh did uh when he was in the Army McCarthy hearings uh against Joe McCarthy, he said, 'Have you no decency? We are not going to stand for this. And I think that I know I think most Americans really are decent people. Now Heather, you may disagree with me. You don't disagree with me. I don't. No, I think most Americans are decent people. 23:03 Well, if most Americans are decent people, then then as we get deeper and deeper into this fascist state, uh, then more and more people are going to say no. But this is a serious reckoning to be on this because we used to talk about left versus right. Remember those good old days? Yes, those have I do remember them. This has nothing to do with left versus right. This has to do with on the one hand, you know, fascism and the other hand democracy. It has to do with um either freedom and decency uh or it has to do with uh with totalitarianism and and cruelty. Uh and and who is going to be standing up for uh for totalitarianism and for uh for for cruelty and for uh a lot of the things that Trump and the people around him are imposing on America. I think when it comes to it, Heather, and I I really this is a this is a faith. I think Glad 24:02 you have it. I think Americans will be standing up in mass and realize that that is the choice and that it's not just the fun con man who was on TV who wants to make America great again and is willing to stand up to, you know, the elites allegedly. Well, there's going to be, you know, there there is certainly a group of Americans who are absolutely committed to Donald Trump, right? Um I was just in uh Tennessee uh and along the roads, you know, Trump signs everywhere and and these are people who I would meet in cafes and other they're they're American people, lovely people, friendly people. Uh but I think that once people recognize what the stakes are, right? Uh even though the Trump the core Trumpers are going to stay there, a lot of Americans are not going to be willing to do that. And and I want to go back to Mandani for a minute. I was going to just do that. Were you? That's weird. That's a That's a Okay. I was going to say probably not 25:04 what you were going to say. You saw that Trump said, 'I will have him arrested if he disagrees with anything we say in terms of ICE.' I mean, he's already out of the gate. He's already out of the gate because this guy is progressive. But that's what that's that's Maldonni. What he did is put together a coalition. Uh a multi-racial, multithnic, multiclass coalition. Now granted, it is New York City and New York City is not America by any stretch. Did you see all the maps? It was fascinating who who voted for him. Yeah. Well, I'm, you know, again, as I try to calm myself about what's happening, um, I say not only will this force Americans to take a stand, uh, and most people are decent and they will take a stand against this and they will let their politicians know and, uh, but I also look at the upcoming young politicians like, uh, Maldani and 26:03 Mdani. Yes. And, and what what they've managed to do. Right. Right. Right. Right. Can you your substack yesterday about universities was so specific and scary. Can you review a little bit of what's been happening in terms of pen and well this is University of Virginia again a a fascist technique and you you don't have to look very far. I mean like Victor Orban in Hungary did it. Once you take over uh the major parts of government, once you substitute the civil service for your, you know, put your loyalists in uh and you put pressure on the courts and you do all of those things, then you focus on the universities uh because they are potential sources of push back. Uh that's where you have a lot of people in almost every society uh that are cosmopolitan that are thinking about uh what's happening in the world uh that are aware of the dangers of fascism and they're unifying universities. They are 27:03 powerhouses of young people coming together. Exactly. And this is a threat to totalitarians to tyrants. Uh and so uh what happened just recently the University of Virginia uh Trump put pressure on the University of Virginia to get rid of its president not because of anti-semitism. This was DEI. Uh this is another so-called kind of bogeyman uh of Trump's DEI. Now, now DEI, diversity, equity, and inclusion. I'm sorry. I used to think those, in fact, I still do. Those are good things. Uh but he has made them into bad things. So, University of Virginia was not going fast enough on DEI and therefore uh the president is out. Uh now at Harvard there is a new civil rights suit lawsuit uh coming from the government against Harvard on top of everything else that Harvard has been contending with uh just 28:05 this week. Um and uh you have uh various universities that are willing to like University of Pennsylvania willing to bow to Trump's demands with regard to transgender athletes. Now what this has to do remember DEI transgender athletes uh you know anti-semitism I mean these are all pretexts right these are all just rational ration for taking over the American university systems u and or intimidating so many professors and so many others in a university that they don't want to take any chances right uh and that's again right out of Victor Orban's playbook book. I know it. Um, so when we were Oh, I have an apology to make to everyone because we were in New York last week and we were in the park and we heard birds and then I pulled up the Merlin app, which I love. Um, to Do 29:02 you remember that? So, basically, you said, 'Hold on, I'm going to mess it up.' You said it's a swallow. I said it's a finch. And then the app said it's a sparrow. And I said you were right. I was right. No, you So, but then it was amazing. I said it was a sparrow. Can I say it was a sparrow? I think you said it swallow. Yeah, but it was a sparrow. Swallow sparrow. Anyway, it was hilarious how many people were like, 'Wrong bird, wrong.' So many bird. I didn't know our fabulous people that are listening to us and contributing and joining us are such avid bird watchers. And did you see the eagle? No, you didn't see American Eagle. No. Did Trump sign it? Because I might have gotten in line for that. Um, but so we were there for this film called The Last Class, which you allowed us unknowingly to make um, watching you teach your last semester of the big undergraduate class, but it's such an important moment. Big undergraduate class here at Berkeley. UC Berkeley. Yeah. Yeah, that was your big undergraduate class. But it's you contending with retirement. We don't 30:03 discuss. Sorry. No, we won't talk about it. And then also, can you use the R word? No, no, no, no. That wasn't me. and aging and your students retirement students inheriting a world out of balance. But this it's this candid look and I want everyone to see it if they want to see it. But but Heather, you've done an extraordinary job and Elliot Kushner, the director, did an extraordinary job. I did not see it until quite recently. You saw it two weeks ago. And I saw two weeks ago was the first time forced him to. Um and um and I had the privilege a few nights ago of seeing it with my granddaughter and there were some points in the in the movie where um you know people tear up. I teared up and she grabbed my hand. She's 16 years old and she put her hand on her head on my shoulder at just the moment and I thought okay this is it doesn't get more meaningful or better 31:00 than this. you know, the world is falling apart. Uh we're in a a fascist state. Um you know, it couldn't get worse out there, but in terms of this experience, it is beautiful. I love that for you. So, sign up at the lastclassfilm.com if you want to know. It's playing all over the country right now. Eventually, we'll be putting it online and things like that. But I have a question. But wait a minute. I have a question for you. Movies are dying. It's hard. Well, wait. Let me just finish the thought. There there almost no movie theaters left. I mean I you know Berkeley used to have I think 11 Yeah, 12 movie theaters. Now we're down to one or two. Uh how did you manage to get this film in so many movie theaters since there aren't any? Well, exactly right. So, we're using a new process called theatrical on demand, which basically just means if someone wants the movie to come to their own local theater. They just have to sell 32:00 enough tickets to tip it. So, I could say, I'm going to get my PTA, my book group, my indivisible group, and I just need to sell 50 tickets. And you can find out more about this at the lastclassfilm.com. The last film, that's all one word.com. You're good at this game. Well, I I mean, but I'm excited. So I'm just saying you are you were very excited. I think your excitement is very infectious. So we had thousands of people see this film. We had 500 people in Minneapolis. We sold out in St. Louis. We were in Miami. We were in Portland. We were in um Houston. We were I mean all over. And people showed up and they sent us photos and they sent us videos and they said thank you. And there was one person who said it was on my bucket list to go to this theater in Denver. I had never been to the Mayan. I did that and I spoke up. I've never spoken up in front of a group of strangers before and there were hundreds of people and I felt the urge to do so because I was motivated thinking about the profound impact uh education has on democ democracy and how intertwined they 33:00 have to be. Well, this is the theme. It's the theme of the film. It's one of my central theme of your life of my life that education and democracy are intricately and intimately connected. why Trump is going after not just higher education, but he's also withholding funds for primary and secondary education right now. Why? Uh again, look at the fascist playbook. Uh what you want to do is make sure that education and educational institutions are dysfunctional. Uh because you don't want an educated populace. You want people who are just going to follow you. uh education is your enemy. Uh this is why, you know, the Nazis burned books. This is why uh fascists through history, totalitarians, dictators, uh close universities. Uh it's why it's why slave owners uh in the 19th century in the United States uh didn't want their slaves to learn and prohibited them from 34:03 even attending school and beitate and be illiterate because because if you know how to think, if you know how to use critical judgment, you're going to see Yes. you're going to see what's going on. Uh and you're going to have to stand up. And he's going after I mean it's the levels, right? So it's the administrations, it's the curricula. We've seen the book bands that have gone in many states across many levels of education. And then it's the funding. Absolutely. It's the And it's all connected. I mean, if you don't if you say, for example, that Americans should not know uh of Americans history and America's history of racism and of uh genocide with regard to Native American people. Uh well then if you don't know that how can you possibly see it when it's happening again or it's happening around you or it's happening in Israel and in Palestine. I appreciate your point about there being a national reckoning and that being a potential 35:06 positive. So it's a big positive. I feel hopeful about that. But Bob, it's July 4th weekend. How do we I mean celebrate? How do we celebrate? Celebrate. I can't even use the verb. Well, you're you're you're raising a very troubling and good point because part of the national reckoning and I'm going to come back to that term again and again has to do with what we mean by patriotism. What is the real meaning of patriotism is not just just waving flags and sending off fireworks and standing for the national anthem. Patriotism is a matter of being willing to sacrifice for the ideals that have been handed down to us from generations that have sacrificed. What are those ideals? The ideals are the rule of law, democracy, the bill of rights, civil liberties, civil liberties, but also tolerance and inclusion. Uh and yes, diversity. E pluribus unum. uh there these are these 36:07 are the fundamentals of patriotism. Uh and if we are instead getting hoodwinkedked into into worshiping uh a man who represents the opposite of all of these things, opposite of the rule of law, opposite of democracy, opposite of tolerance. uh who is really uh fueling bigotry uh and oppression and fear and cruelty uh then we are not patriots. We are not acting as patriots. We have to make sure that we understand the true meaning and the true requirements of patriotism. Okay. Well, I'll guess I'll have a hot dog and then uh but light, I guess. I I want thinking about those things. Well, 37:03 it we're at a we're at a difficult point in time. I'm glad to see you every week for coffee. And you Yeah, I am too. I am too. I I want to thank you again. Uh it was great being in Central Park. God, that was good. Should we go on more? I think we should do more outings. I think we should do more outings. That's I was just going to say that. I think we should do more out outings. Uh let me let me just say uh to all of you uh and Heather I want to thank you but I also want to thank all of you uh this is a a rough time. We knew it was going to get very rough. The passage of this big, bad, horrible bill is a point in time that forces us to reflect on what we believe, but also who we are and who we want to be. uh as does a weekend called a July 4th 38:02 weekend in which we have to I think contemplate what patriotism really means and requires what this country is all about. I have some friends who are leaving America. Well, I understand that. I'm not going to dump on them for doing that. But it is very important that those of us who can, who are able stay here and fight. That is ultimately the test of patriotism. Our willingness, our ability to fight for the ideals that made this nation a nation that at least some of us, at least at some point in the not too distant past, were proud of. We'll see you next week.

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