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Robert Reich

Robert Reich vs Jeffrey Lord, CNN Battle as Trump Slams Chuck Jones Calling Him Lies on Carrier Jobs

Burgess COMMENTARY

Peter Burgess

Robert Reich vs Jeffrey Lord, CNN Battle as Trump Slams Chuck Jones Calling Him Lies on Carrier Jobs

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Published on Dec 7, 2016 CNN Anderson Cooper 360 12/07/2016. Former Labor Sec Robert Reich vs Trump supporter Jeffrey Lord in CNN Panel Battle after Donald Trump Tweeted Responding to Carrier Union Leader Chuck Jones Calling Him Lies on 550 Carrier Jobs saved. Category News & Politics License Standard YouTube License SHOW LESS COMMENTS • 955

Transcript

English (Automatic Captions) 0:00we are back talking about Twitter and 0:02how the president-elect uses it not only 0:04that this practice of mr. Trump 0:05personalizing not just aspects of the 0:07economy but now some of the players 0:08powerful not so powerful specifically 0:10this tweet about carrier chuck jones he 0:13said just a short time ago who is 0:15president of United Steelworkers 1999 0:16has done a terrible job representing 0:18workers no wonder companies flee the 0:21country 0:22we just had Chuck Jones on the the phone 0:24a short time ago just the top of 0:26Broadcasters when he said be quite 0:29honest what I did I did an interview and 0:33I called him out on some of the things 0:36that you mislead the people on far as 0:39the actual numbers of jobs said he 0:41claimed that the save and and it was 800 0:44it wasn't over 1,100 I giving praise and 0:48thanks for everything he it saved the 0:51800 people's jobs i really appreciate 0:54that 0:54he also varying the conference with 0:58these are your people last Thursday got 1:01up and said he never made any 1:03commitments and promises to carry your 1:05people to keep our jobs here which was 1:07complete falsehood said numerous times 1:10on the campaign of his campaign speeches 1:15and he denied that and back with the 1:19panel including out from her labor 1:21secretary Robert Bryce a secretary right 1:24do you think I mean do we know how this 1:27plays out over time and we've had 1:28presidents before who've kept any 1:30enemies less don't from certainly has a 1:32long memory of people who slided him or 1:34people he feels have been unfair to him 1:36um I guess one question is how does this 1:39play out over you know right now it 1:41seems even for those who like don't from 1:43tweeting like this it seems refreshing 1:45its new its it's different over time 1:48does it just seem better and better or 1:51does it does it not play so-so well to 1:54his supporters even anderson i think 1:56over time it becomes more and more 1:57dangerous to a democracy which depends 2:00upon freedom of speech and freedom of 2:02the press if people are intimidated if 2:05individual people feel that they cannot 2:08criticize the president of the united 2:10states because he will using 2:13his twitter account we're using whatever 2:15means he has directly communicate to 2:18millions of people personal criticisms 2:21of the people who criticize him and then 2:23there is going to be a massive 2:25intimidation a chilling effect on free 2:28speech and also on freedom of the press 2:30this is extremely serious this is not 2:33merely talking about fireside chats or 2:36harry truman being angry at some critic 2:40of his daughters this goes to the 2:41essential core of a democracy 2:44we're talking about the freedom of 2:46people to express their criticisms of 2:49the president of the united states 2:50without fear of retribution without fear 2:54that the press of the United States is 2:55going to single them out condemn them 2:58and humiliate them in the light of 3:00millions of other people it is pretty 3:02well i'm trying to think of other cases 3:03where presidents of the united states 3:06have in such a public forum gone after 3:09private individuals not networks just 3:12you know individuals who he died like I 3:15think the Obama White House but not only 3:17fox news but i think they went after 3:18climbing back in the day who had a 3:19television program and I think they went 3:22to great lengths to preserve to savage 3:24it going critical that though I mean I i 3:27think that was that was bad actually for 3:29the Obama administration do that 3:30precisely because it comes with the the 3:33power of the the President and have the 3:36senior White House officials going out 3:37and doing this and it's showing I just 3:39don't think you should be singling out 3:40news organizations and attacking them 3:42and saying they're not legitimate which 3:43is what they were doing so I mean 3:45consistent here i think that when they 3:47shouldn't have been doing and I don't 3:48think chocolate but there's every 3:49president has complained about the press 3:51and sometimes when i get better 3:53reporters that's not new but I can't 3:55think of any Jeffries a great student of 3:57history is a time a president elected 3:58president has reached all the way into 4:01the heart of Middle American frankly the 4:04very profile of the Trump voters mean 4:05this is this is what the most troubling 4:07thing about this is that in the main yes 4:11mr. Jones able to come on your broadcast 4:12in the main he's not able to defend 4:14himself he's not in and Donald Trump 4:16with one push of a button reaches 16 4:18million people then we all pick it up as 4:20we should and must and then it reaches a 4:21billion people lets anyone shark Jones 4:23can't defend himself and that's what's 4:25so chilling is if he's going to do that 4:26to chuck 4:27bones you know many CEOs are watching 4:29the same i'm never gonna stick my head 4:31up I don't want to criticize after what 4:32happened to boeing boeing criticizes 4:34trade policies how many other 4:35politicians are going to say oh yeah 4:37just for the record on Trump said he 4:38didn't read that chicago tribune article 4:40in which hotel Boeing was quoted it did 4:42come out very shortly after that part of 4:44what's really interesting is that I've 4:46watched the last couple days i want to 4:47so many rallies with Donald Trump they 4:49were filled with the union workers they 4:52put him in office so it's that it's a 4:54really contradictory thing to see him 4:56attacking a union worker and then you 4:58have the CEOs when you put steve 5:00schwarzman the head of black stone is 5:02part of his big panel and he's got all 5:04these CEOs I talked to a CEO today said 5:06I've got to get on one of these panels 5:08with him so now I here in the trunk 5:11world they're going to now pick up 5:12manufacturing panel they've got the text 5:15CEOs coming in that the CEOs out there 5:17are doing a flip flop to try to get 5:19involved with the Trump administration 5:21because they see the dealmaker in chief 5:23coming on strong and so here are the 5:25people who are on the sidelines that he 5:27attacked now they want to be part I 5:28wasn't always that want to be part of it 5:31exactly you're of not being exactly or 5:33over television they either want to be 5:35in his good graces or they think well he 5:37really is going to change the 5:39architecture of this country and lower 5:42corporate taxes etc and we want in but 5:45another thing that's problematic about 5:46the way that he's used twitter if you 5:49look at attacking Boeing and what 5:50happens with their stock prices you know 5:52a long time ago I worked in the office 5:54in the White House the US Trade 5:55Representative's office that handled 5:57trade and as a junior spokesperson you 5:59were really schooled and you can never 6:01say anything that has not been cleared 6:04by 50 people it has to be very few every 6:07word has been measured absolutely 6:09perfectly because it will move market 6:11and he is the president of the United 6:13States tweeting about what circuit looks 6:15out of the former Labor Secretary is 6:17really Secretary Rice what about that i 6:18mean the power of the presidency to move 6:20markets with a few words here there 6:24well the power of the presidency not 6:26only to move markets but also to unleash 6:29a hail storm of criticism against 6:31individuals who have the d'oeuvre 6:33and-and-and audacity to too cheap to 6:36speak their minds 6:37i mean we're talking about 6:38the presidential power here in its 6:40rawest and most important form it has to 6:44be used with a great deal of decorum 6:46with a great deal of sensitivity and 6:49that's why this is so concerning because 6:51here we have the president-elect of the 6:53United States not some candidates the 6:55president-elect of the United States who 6:58is tweeting to 12 million or 16 million 7:01followers criticisms of individuals who 7:04dare correct him dare to speak out about 7:07what the president-elect of the United 7:09States doing this is something new we 7:11have not seen this before and it does 7:14pose a huge potential danger not just 7:16the company's yes there will be a 7:18chilling effect on individual CEOs who 7:20will not want to speak out against a 7:22president or president elect Donald 7:24Trump for fear that he's going to say 7:25something that causes their stock prices 7:27to go down and yes the president has got 7:29to be very careful about what he says 7:31given the inside the economy as a whole 7:33but what about the reputations of 7:35individuals what about keeping their 7:37jobs 7:38what about other people who are so angry 7:41by what a president may say about a 7:44particular individuals that they 7:46actually go out and and seek some sort 7:48of revenge and this is raw power re 7:51dangerous secretary she said something 7:53here that this is not been seen before 7:56and I would just say to everybody 7:59we're going to see a lot of this this is 8:01going to be a very unconventional 8:02presidency by the lights of Washington 8:04DC and the established ways of doing 8:07things 8:08it's not just this it's going to be a 8:10whole lot of things to come 8:11he's going to be very very different he 8:13comes straight from the private sector 8:14he's never been a governor senator he's 8:17never been in Washington as a business 8:19you know as an elected official he's 8:21going to do things differently which is 8:22why i would suggest he was elected in 8:25the first place so I would respectfully 8:27suggest this is the tip of the iceberg 8:28and we're going to see a lot more of a 8:30whole lot of different things that he's 8:32going to do very different look but i 8:34don't think anybody voted for him hoping 8:35he would beat up on chuck the steel 8:37worker because Chuck criticized him i 8:39think that's different nobody upon big 8:41reporter think of big networks like I 8:42was ok long showers or whatever American 8:45people aren't dumb they realize these 8:47this guy voted for hillary clinton as 8:48you yourself said he's a political 8:49opponent 8:50no he's not here somewhere 8:52our consideration he so people can be an 8:54American citizen and be able to running 8:55on it really come on Jeffrey you're too 8:57decent you are too decent to think it's 8:59okay for a billionaire president like to 9:02pick on a working-class all men are 9:05created equal declaration identity and 9:07I'm gonna say something really think 9:09that's okay Secretary Rice good because 9:10that let me just let me just say 9:12something because it certainly is ok for 9:16president of the United States to 9:18criticize a network criticized in 9:21industry criticize a large group of 9:24people but it is qualitatively different 9:27for a president or president-elect of 9:30the United States to criticize an 9:32individual who is exercising his First 9:35Amendment rights to criticize that 9:37president-elect that there is a huge 9:39power imbalance and that power imbalance 9:42could create a situation and where maybe 9:45not that far away from it if this 9:47continues Anderson you said what happens 9:49if this continues if this continues and 9:51grows we could have a situation where 9:53people across the board are scared to 9:56speak out they are intimidated because 9:57they don't want to be punished 9:59I don't think so I don't think so I mean 10:01I mean if you're old enough and i hate 10:03to say the gray hair attest to it but 10:05I've seen people in the streets my 10:07generation protesting Lyndon Johnson 10:09using all kinds of language that you 10:12can't use on television they weren't 10:13scared and lyndon johnson was one of the 10:15most intimidating presidents of the 10:16United States the ground Johnson attack 10:18you personally when you're doing Jeffrey 10:19nobody certainly went after the anti-war 10:21press with protein called nervous 10:23Nellie's that there's a big difference 10:24between there is a big difference 10:26between going after a group of people 10:28that's what I'm saying and growing going 10:29after an individual and using the power 10:32of the presidency or the president-elect 10:34of the United States to go after it was 10:37not a whole point was not as the 10:39intimidation of God dangerous shot one 10:41of them are good job that this is not 10:43just chuck jones some guy I'm sure he's 10:45a perfectly decent soul but he but he 10:48represents steelworkers union he himself 10:51is a political opponent who admit to 10:54that 10:54what is it was wrong haha it's great 10:56that he said anything you want but it is 10:59nothing i said that was there are 11:00actually more jobs that need to be saved 11:02I mean what was it that he said that was 11:04so horrible that would 11:05would that because actually I want the 11:07reaction be oh ok let's go look at these 11:09other jobs and see what we can do to 11:10thank them 11:11I i can only tell you when a political 11:15opponent goes after you you go after the 11:17back 11:17I mean that is what i want a dark is 11:19ridiculous that was one of the devil you 11:22know is that when i was born to run 11:24you're saying that's ridiculous that's 11:27ridiculous because we just had an 11:28election and if you take as your 11:31definition of political opponent anybody 11:33who voted against Donald Trump there are 11:36tens of millions of people right now in 11:38the United States who would be defined 11:40as political opponents and under that 11:41definition it would be a perfectly fine 11:44for the president to everyday tweet 11:46about one of those political opponents 11:48and say something negative about what 11:50they've got a scent isn't that's an 11:52absurd argument but i don't okay i don't 11:55think that Donald Trump cares whether 11:57the still president still worker 11:59president voted for him or against him i 12:01think he is upset that he's stepping on 12:04his show and that he had a great coup 12:07last week and got a lot of plot its and 12:10now he's undercutting it i really think 12:12that Donald Trump is a show men as well 12:15as the president-elect and he doesn't 12:17like this guy's undercutting what was a 12:19a really good show and presentation it 12:23is interesting though you know it 12:24probably took harry truman a little bit 12:26of time to write that letter 12:28it doesn't take a lot of time to send a 12:29tweet and don't Trump 25 extra Donald 12:32Trump which wich for better or worse is 12:35writing in the moment 12:36clear-rite and you know oftentimes a 12:40wise person wants to call you know think 12:44things through a little bit and let the 12:46moment pass count to ten breathe and 12:49then he wants to set the record straight 12:51right away and put and get that grin 12:55right now didn't he made a mistake it's 12:57not a mistake he made he did a good 12:58thing he claimed a great thing Chuck 13:01called him on it no big deal 13:03actually he just wants to defang any and 13:06personally attacked the guy who 13:07criticized and that's what's chillin 13:08that they want to set the record 13:09straight maybe there's another way to 13:11copy only reported the numbers like 13:12these yeah we're so you know right it's 13:15not as if that hadn't been on the record 13:16it was hit this guy it was something 13:18about Chuck's 13:19think this and then it was a bait and 13:21switch or whatever the term is insane 13:23time solid majority of voters even if i 13:25get to say he's an awful lot of 13:26political enemies if that's your if I 13:28could just saying in an immediate sense 13:29i mean i'm sure we're going to have a 13:31lot of these in the next four years that 13:33this is getting like the demonstration 13:35down there in texas for that nutjob 13:37there that was the white supremacist 13:39that the media tends to overplay these 13:41things vastly overplay their worth in a 13:44situation like this and i just don't 13:46think it's that that big a deal the 13:48president united states the new 13:49president united states tweets which is 13:52what everybody in America person around 13:53the world it's a new technology we're 13:56probably going to have some adjustments 13:57to make over this but he is setting a 13:58precedent that other presidents are 14:00going to use in their own fashion I hope 14:03not I hope not we have a president 14:05president of the united states now 14:07through twitter has access directly 14:10unmediated access to 16 million people 14:1320 million people and i hope this 14:16doesn't set a precedent for president of 14:18the United States using their power and 14:20direct access unmediated without any 14:23criticisms our any media between that 14:26President and everybody else I to single 14:28out individuals for criticism and blame 14:30that is dangerous folks like what mr. 14:33secretary with all due respect franklin 14:34roosevelt use the radio to get around 14:36Republican newspaper publishers of the 14:38day it was to raid in Iove you 14:40he did not criticize individuals make 14:42the secretary would alter the facts joe 14:45mccarthy in the nineteen fifties as 14:47Senator Joe McCarthy and his communist 14:49which ones he went through after 14:51individuals he was not present he did 14:53have a lot of power and you know what 14:54happened to those individuals those 14:56individuals lost their jobs they lost a 14:58lot of other they they were intimidated 15:00by joe mccarthy and until finally one 15:05member of the press stood up to Joe 15:07McCarthy and said basically i'm joe 15:10mccarthy is a a desperate is he is a 15:13dictator he's dangerous to the country 15:15are we going to have to wait for 15:17somebody to stand up to Donald Trump and 15:19say this is the second a lot of respect 15:21for you but I just think that's his 15:22stereo and i just think that's typical 15:25you know what's wrong with this is you 15:27don't think that what we are now 15:28witnessing is dangerous 15:29no no are you kidding me no look 15:32Anderson 15:32Cooper CNN fox news everybody is going 15:35to be on Donald Trump's case for the 15:36next four years 8 years whatever turns 15:38out to be as they are with every 15:40president the united states and Donald 15:42Trump has spent a lot of his time are 15:44condemning the media and condemning 15:46individual and West john f kennedy 15:48cancel the New York Herald Tribune so 15:50what condemning individual journalists 15:52condemning individual journalists I'm 15:54sorry that we aren't completely new zone 15:58here a new era when you have technology 16:01it's the 20 contacting you have direct 16:05contact between the president and 16 16:08million Americans many weapons and 16:11criticizing individuals average 16:14Americans I'm sorry there is something 16:16wrong with that 16:17and if you don't see the danger in it 16:19that itself with all due respect is very 16:21dangerous 16:22don't bring in CNN's Martin Savidge was 16:23at the carrier plant on Jeff was talking 16:26about Chuck Jones being a political 16:28opponent of Donald Trump you've been 16:29speaking with him is that how he sees 16:31himself know he doesn't mean I've talked 16:36to chuck jones quite a few times my port 16:37visit here in the last 10 days 16:40Chuck Jones will admit that he voted for 16:42Hillary Clinton he will also say he 16:44voted holding his nose he definitely did 16:47not like either choice and i will point 16:49out that the local union did not make 16:52any political endorsement for the 16:54presidential campaign is quite right to 16:56crew to say that the International 16:58united steelworkers did endorse Hillary 17:00Clinton for the local union made no 17:02official endorsement and again Chuck 17:04Jones will say and he said it to me many 17:07times he is grateful to Donald Trump he 17:10is amazed that Donald Trump was able to 17:12pull off saving 800 jobs his particular 17:16point was at that announcement the 1100 17:20figure that was used was inaccurate and 17:23as a result there were several hundred 17:24of his members who thought their jobs 17:26might be saved that impact their jobs 17:29will not be but 800 jobs regardless our 17:33remaining right here in Indianapolis 17:34something that a month ago no one would 17:37have believed it and it is interesting 17:39Jessica's don't from coming I think that 17:41point that Paul already made but he's 17:43not responding to that particular 17:46factual a you know to that fact or that 17:49allegation he's donating the credibility 17:52angry at that and so he's poking it with 17:55a perceived weakness or write whatever 17:58it might be I mean that that's it's a 17:59little different than saying well 18:01actually no mr. Jones here's what 18:03happened it's you know you your lousy 18:07and and you're partly responsible for 18:09these jobs leave 18:10well I mean I I'd i just think this 18:12whole thing is getting basseley 18:13overblown here and that it took to what 18:16I mean that the one again Donald Trump 18:19is the only person who did this 18:21I mean both the present sitting 18:23president the united states and Hillary 18:24Clinton had the chance to do this and so 18:26this is the reaction it's it's only 800 18:29jobs when I could have been 300 I mean 18:31it would have been zero job so that's 18:33not the only reaction because mr. Jones 18:34himself is saying he's very appreciative 18:36of these is 800 jobs and and nobody 18:40seems to be disputing that nobody can 18:42just switch for sec like to Boeing okay 18:44so they're bowing happen and he Donald 18:48Trump says I didn't do it because what 18:50the CEO said that that may actually be 18:53true it may not be true who knows but we 18:55know Donald Trump was always in 18:59construction in we know Hillary Clinton 19:01made a big point of this during the 19:02campaign that he tried to squeeze every 19:05penny out of every contractor remember 19:07when she would say on the campaign trail 19:09thank goodness my father the drapery 19:12contractor did not have him because he 19:15would try did not have him as a client 19:16so we try to squeeze him so to me when 19:18he came out to say i want to get the 19:21price down bowing your cock cancel the 19:22contract it's just like him to want to 19:25do it i was with Donald Trump once when 19:27he was going through the old post office 19:28he was seeing something on the on the 19:31trim that he didn't like it 19:33he's like well what's the price of this 19:35how much did we pay i could see you is 19:37like it knocked the cost down that we're 19:39going to pay this contractor so it's 19:41totally like him to do this i don't know 19:43whether it's super yet to do it on a 19:45government procurement secretary right 19:47I'm sorry 19:49it may be like him to do this and that 19:51is precisely the problem we are dealing 19:54with right now because as a private 19:56citizen or even as a developer 19:59he was doing all these developments 20:00around the country around the world 20:02Donald Trump was not president-elect of 20:04the United States he was not he didn't 20:06have the power that he has right now and 20:09it's not a matter of just correcting the 20:11record with regards to something that 20:13Chuck Jones has said it is actually 20:15attacking him personally 20:18it's saying he is a lousy union leader 20:21it's like going after allegan and alec 20:24baldwin saying that Alec Baldwin is as a 20:26lot is lousy is not funny 20:28rather than correcting the record if 20:31there's some satirical issue that Donald 20:33Trump has with alec baldwin are going 20:35after a journalist who and an instant 20:38correcting record will and what what 20:40Donald Trump will do with tweets is a 20:43kind of character assassination 20:45it's what he did on the careful fracking 20:47or attacking Boeing which is one of the 20:51companies in the united states that 20:53contributes the most for our gdp of the 20:56of sending a lot of airplanes out of 20:59this country so he does take it on but 21:01he says he's doing it for the u.s. first 21:03we got it we got to take a quick break 21:04the panel's gonna stick around 60 rights 21:05cannot we appreciate you being with us 21:07mr. secretary thank you more to talk 21:09about